The Hornshoppe Forum
July 27, 2017, 01:46:41 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: SMF - Just Installed!
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2 3
  Print  
Author Topic: I need your help on cooling fan blues.  (Read 5831 times)
Steve F
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 403


View Profile Email
« on: November 23, 2015, 04:21:08 AM »

I've got a problem with cooling fans. (Got other problems too
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 10:36:01 AM by Steve F » Logged
sonic
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 394



View Profile
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2015, 07:58:44 AM »

It's hard to respond without knowing what those problems are.  Are they noise problem, fan blade not turning, not switching on or...etc?
Logged
Steve F
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 403


View Profile Email
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2015, 10:46:23 AM »

The last part of my post disappeared in the ether.

I need, and have not been able to find:

24V muffin fan, size 80 x 80 x 25. I need one that is really really quiet. Durability is an issue, so dual ball bearing or fancy bearing preferred. A low speed motor is fine. I am using a 2500 rpm motor now, which replaced a 4000 rpm unit. I could probably get by with 1200 rpm without adverse effect. Suggestions please, brands, stores, and suggestions. I can't run a pair of 12V fans, and AC fans are out.

steve
Logged
Ed Schilling
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1299


View Profile Email
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2015, 09:57:55 PM »

Steve, this is just too easy............get a 12V fan and use a 7812 regulator to get the 24v down to 12v....no heat sink will be needed.........glue it to the fan if you have space.
Ed
Logged
jimcant
Newbie
*
Posts: 11


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2015, 11:44:29 PM »

You're the man Ed Wink

I feel like an Antipodean Hillbilly Shocked

I had the same issue with a noisy cooling fan on my Behringer EP2500 as well as inadequate cooling on my Rythmik plate amps, which would get hot enough to fry eggs on, before they threw in the towel, so I did this:



12V computer case fans and a Ryobi cordless drill plug pack charger (7.2Volt I think).
I worked out that the speed of these fans was voltage dependant, and I could vary it with the choice of wall wart I used.
Ed's solution is far better, but I did not know any better Embarrassed
It works though Grin

Cheers,
Jim
Logged
Steve F
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 403


View Profile Email
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2015, 11:48:54 PM »

Ed, I just slapped myself Dinozzo style. Yep that will work. I'll run over to rat shack tomorrow. Thanks.

steve

Logged
sonic
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 394



View Profile
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2015, 08:44:21 AM »

Rythmik plate amps, which would get hot enough to fry eggs on,
It shouldn't have.  It's either defective or misused.  Or the third possibility is, incompetently designed.
Logged
sonic
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 394



View Profile
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2015, 08:52:54 AM »

I'll run over to rat shack tomorrow.
Try computer store instead.  There are tons of fans with so called extra quiet design.
Logged
Steve F
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 403


View Profile Email
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2015, 12:05:43 PM »

Jim, I have a more basic rythmik system than yours. Mine's older w/o parametric EQ. I don't have an overheat problem at all. Brian may be able to help out. I remember they had some QC problems with some amps. I've never really been too impressed by plate amps anyway. I wonder if anyone could adapt the Rythmik servo to the big Crown amps. Maybe an even bigger bucket sub. Might be cool to run a couple of buckets, and the Servo for very low frequency.
Logged
Henry
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 800


View Profile WWW
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2015, 12:36:47 PM »

Steve, pick up a Crown and walk away.  Smiley

They really are that good and that flexible.  AB sub amps can be good, but these will make your smile grow wider.  I proclaim it to be true.  Cheesy 
Logged
jimcant
Newbie
*
Posts: 11


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2015, 03:00:18 PM »

Rythmik plate amps, which would get hot enough to fry eggs on,
It shouldn't have.  It's either defective or misused.  Or the third possibility is, incompetently designed.

I suspect the issue lies with the fact that they are driving 2x15" drivers ea ie 4 ohm loads in OB,
so not very efficient for the input power required. Don't know, they have always run hot when pushed.

The toroidal transformers in them are also quite "buzzy", so much so that I don't leave them in standby mode because the buzzing annoys me.
Bear in mind, they are running on 240 volts downunder, whether that makes any difference.

Other than that, they do the job OK, but I would like to be able to just keep the crossover componentry of these and use something like a Crown amp for the actual power amp side.
These A370PEQ plate amps do have some useful features, PEQ, shelving filters, phase and adjustable slopes (I use the 12dB ones for my OB bass).

The slowed down case fans are completely silent and keep the heatsink at ampient temperature for the most part. This same alteration keeps my once noisy Behringer EP2500 almost silent as well, but still cool.
The only thing to watch with these reduced voltages, I believe, is that the fans have sufficient voltage
to start up, so a bit of trial and error if you want to get the speed right down.

Cheers,
Jim
Logged
Steve F
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 403


View Profile Email
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2015, 04:23:42 PM »

Henry,
Got 2 Crown XLS1500s. I agree they are silent and work well too. The bad news... I can't use them on my ESLs mostly because THE ESL and A/B amp guru says it is a very bad idea. Class D and ESL trannies don't get along. I couldn't spend $5K on a monster amp so I had to go to one of three alternatives. I don't like big tube amps, they are expensive, heat the house, waste energy, have rolled off high frequencies, the list goes on. I could get a big used A/B amp without a switching power supply, but a good one like a Hafler DH500 would be a lot of work. So option three is a Class H pro amp with a couple of small mods. That's where I went. I use one of the Crown amps for bass duties. It is actually a bit too small vs the Class H amp. I guess I'm not a member of the SET society anymore.

Jim, is the toroidal transformer screwed down tight? Mine has an EL type and no problems.

steve
Logged
johnnycopy
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 86


View Profile Email
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2015, 05:50:42 PM »

Rythmik plate amps, which would get hot enough to fry eggs on,
It shouldn't have.  It's either defective or misused.  Or the third possibility is, incompetently designed.

I suspect the issue lies with the fact that they are driving 2x15" drivers ea ie 4 ohm loads in OB,
so not very efficient for the input power required. Don't know, they have always run hot when pushed.

The toroidal transformers in them are also quite "buzzy", so much so that I don't leave them in standby mode because the buzzing annoys me.
Bear in mind, they are running on 240 volts downunder, whether that makes any difference.

Other than that, they do the job OK, but I would like to be able to just keep the crossover componentry of these and use something like a Crown amp for the actual power amp side.
These A370PEQ plate amps do have some useful features, PEQ, shelving filters, phase and adjustable slopes (I use the 12dB ones for my OB bass).

The slowed down case fans are completely silent and keep the heatsink at ampient temperature for the most part. This same alteration keeps my once noisy Behringer EP2500 almost silent as well, but still cool.
The only thing to watch with these reduced voltages, I believe, is that the fans have sufficient voltage
to start up, so a bit of trial and error if you want to get the speed right down.

Cheers,
Jim

Exact same rythmik/augie config as you jim, and no eggs will fry on mine.  I run two 15 augies per amp with four in total (2 amps). No buzz, dead silent. You may have a different oroblem.

Are you using the line level or speaker level inputs?  I went to speaker level, and biwired.  They kick ass.
Logged
Ed Schilling
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1299


View Profile Email
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2015, 06:42:05 PM »

4 - 15 inch drivers.....for bass, no thanks!  Guys, 2 FFRS Mark 4:20i and a Crown XLS will make more output, an octave lower and less distortion than 4 - 15's on a board. And you can hide them easily. No heat from the Crown. My FFRS is in a corner behind a cabinet. It will literally, not figuratively shake the room on stuff that actually has extreme LF content, like Madonna. They never "stand out" however.

They are the best "true" subs I've heard regardless of cost when used with a Crown XLS. It would/will not hurt my feelings if someone that has built one properly disagrees....

I've heard 2 "augies" in my room. Not even close. They are not "subs".....the FFRS is.  As a matter of fact I sold my first two to a friend and built a third.....was going to build a 4th but lost interest.....it's just not needed. Sure, it would increase output and lower distortion and cost me a staggering 75 bucks but there really is no need. So of course I'll build it one day Smiley

4- FFRS....two Crown XLS2500's........tell us what you think Henry Smiley Are 4- 8 inch drivers in buckets and 4800 watts enough to "pressurize" a room to ear popping levels (literally, not figuratively)? Smiley

Ed

***** Edit**** John, good to know you tried the speaker level connection. Even if the pre amp can drive a second set of outputs (yours should be able to) I have never found the integration to be as good as when the exact same system is used but the connection is speaker level. Many will disagree and that's ok.....it never hurts to try both! My Crown never gets warm, btw.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2015, 08:01:43 PM by Ed Schilling » Logged
Steve F
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 403


View Profile Email
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2015, 09:26:32 PM »

I have a pair (not currently using) of Linkwitz Orion speakers. Yes to some extent they are speakers on a board. There are a few differences. Linkwitz developed a complex crossover with equalization and the speaker has two 10" long throw magnesium drivers each. They can move enough air to get pretty loud bass. Even then he made a pair of external subs available. His new speaker has even more woofer, also 10" with longer throws. Getting strong bass out of speakers on boards is difficult. Remember that moving that much air involves the mass of the air, and how far you push it. 15" drivers are almost always mid bass drivers. Most are designed for PA use and won't do much below 50HZ. There are 12" and 10" drivers that will easily exceed them below 50-60HZ. The deep bass kings in my experience are long throw 12"in sealed boxes with equalization. Also a couple of 10" drivers in transmission lines, also with EQ. Just a quarter of an inch behind them are the infamous FFRS Mark 4:20i ask bucket subs. This means that except for 1 or 2 CDs you won't be able to hear, or measure a difference in frequency ability. No EQ needed. The Crowns are great amps and can supply a lot of current. You will want 2-4 of them. I ran 2 in mono crossed over at about 60HZ. Henry, running 4 subs can clear his kitchen table with the bass powe available. He also has smoother bass than the rest of us because his subs will control the room nodes. The concept is easy. The drivers in Ed's subs are forced to operate below resonance. Bag End the pro audio company, and Roy Allison ran variants of this.

So guys sell off the giant speakers on a board. If you want, design panels for mids and highs, or use Horns. You will have much better sound. You can build a couple of buckets and get a Crown amp for less than the cost of one side of a double 15" speaker. Amen.

steve
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!